1992 VMax-4 just got it and have some questions

Thanks Al, I had read that thread, and checked my alignment and distance on my lunch break. Looks like I am offset about .750" (which appears to be a little much. Also, the distance between the clutches is a smidge much. It is a little difficult to measure, I will try to get a better set-up going otnight, but I was geting about 14.625". The book is calling for more like .4-.7 on the offset, and 14.4-14.6 on the distance. That should loosen the new belt up some, and help the squeal. Also need to clean my sheaves really well, should have done this before I put on the new belt (dumb).

When lubricating the drive clutch, can I use lithium grease? or must you use powdered graphite?
 

I`m hip...no kind of wet anything...I use a can of dry silicone type spray..seams to work good...

if you spray it on your hand, you hand will be wet for about 10 seconds, then it just seams to dry up/disappear...

it says it`s for "superior high preasure and high temperature" aplications..
Again, avoid the sheaves at all cost!

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OK, messed with the clutches last night...rechecked all of the alignments, and they actually are about perfect. The freeplay on the secondary is barely over the .060" spec (checked about .085"). Offset and distance is right on. The belt din't have any bad spots on it (I haven't put but 1-2 miles on it). I cleaned the sheaves, and they did feel much cleaner. All of the cam-weigths on the drive clutch are tigth and work very free. When you push it into the engaged position, the bushings are tight, not slop. Everything really feels great on the clutches. It is engaging around 3600rpm.

It is still squealing when you first take off!!! And, I don't think it is shifting fast enough. The shifting I am sure is unrelated to the squealing, but still doesn't seem fast enough.

Any ideas?
 
I`m NOT a clutch guy at all...but can you define "not shifting fast enough"..what are you saying it`s doing?
reving without pulling? RPMS not climbing or??

these things are insanely smooth, are you sure your not just spinning and not feeling the pull you expect cause of it?
 
VMax4Rules, I have not checked the belt deflection. How do you do it, I did not see that in my service manual. I would agree that it seems too tight, but didn't know how to check. Also, if the clutch distance measures correctly, why would the belt be too tight? The exposed portion of the belt on the driven is just over a 16th, so that seems good too.

Al, by "shifting too slow" I mean that the engine revs very quickly, and just stays there. The speedometer doesn't indicate a large amount of slip either. After a second or two, then you can feel the engine start to get a load put on it when the clutches move to a higher ratio. I feels like they need to begin shifting quicker into higher ratio.

PS, I cleaned the sheaves really well, and there are some wear grooves in the moveable side of the drive clutch. The fix side is perfectly smooth.
 
vincentblackshawdow said:
VMax4Rules, I have not checked the belt deflection. How do you do it, I did not see that in my service manual. I would agree that it seems too tight, but didn't know how to check. Also, if the clutch distance measures correctly, why would the belt be too tight? The exposed portion of the belt on the driven is just over a 16th, so that seems good too.

Al, by "shifting too slow" I mean that the engine revs very quickly, and just stays there. The speedometer doesn't indicate a large amount of slip either. After a second or two, then you can feel the engine start to get a load put on it when the clutches move to a higher ratio. I feels like they need to begin shifting quicker into higher ratio.

PS, I cleaned the sheaves really well, and there are some wear grooves in the moveable side of the drive clutch. The fix side is perfectly smooth.
Click to expand...

Where`s "there"...what rpm????

Have you tried using a marker, and putting a mark starting in the base of the primary clutch sheave, and extending the black marker line to the edge, and also, reaching in and making a mark on the secondary?
that may help to determine if it`s fully shifting..

AL
 
Just got done riding it, and was going to mark the clutches...now the thing won't run right. I am really starting to get bummed. So now I have to get it running properly again before I can check the clutch shift range. BTW, it is taching to somewhere between 8200-8500 when you go full throttle (when it was still running OK)

The rigth bank of cylinders is not firing consistantly/barely at all. Just put new plugs in, and that didn't help either. Pulled the plugs, and connected teh plug wires with them laying on the head. Started it up to check the spark, and both were firing perfectly, never missed a beat, but when they are back in the head, all I get is just spit and sputter occasionaly. I am thinking it is the coil possibly for that side? Sorry to keep bugging you guys, but the sled is really driving me nuts! And I am going to MI next weekend for 3 days of riding, and really just want a machine that is reliable for now. Do the coils go bad? What other items can cause a weak ignition just all of the sudden on one bank of cylinders? Can the CDI box cause this?
 
just been reading other threads...so you think I have a spun crank?................................we did check compression this evening (I just have a gauge from autozone) and 3 checked 120psi, 1-125psi. I was pretty happy with those numbers, however the thread from Applecider about spun cranks and it running "just like I am describing" makes me really nervous...What do I need to check for the spun crank?
 
put piston 1 (nearest the clutch) at TDC...then see if pistons 3 & 4 are dead even....

this can be decieving...so take your time, and triple check..

do it both ways....do like above...then using straws, line up pistons 3 & 4 even...and see if piston one is at top?

(pistons 3 & 4 will be moving in opisite directions)
 
vincentblackshawdow said:
VMax4Rules, I have not checked the belt deflection. How do you do it, I did not see that in my service manual. I would agree that it seems too tight, but didn't know how to check. Also, if the clutch distance measures correctly, why would the belt be too tight? The exposed portion of the belt on the driven is just over a 16th, so that seems good too.
Click to expand...

Sorry but it's been awhile since I worked on a old school 1992-94 V4 secondary so I am not sure of all of the specs but
there should be a 3 bolt spacer/washer on the outside of the secondary that adjusts the belt height/deflection.
 
mxrules, I know the shims you are talking about. I don't have any of them. May have to get some. Would you be able to adjust the tie-rod for teh clutch distance to get the same effect? or is that a no-no?

Al, I will check the crank in teh morning. I really hope it's not spun, that will really put a damper on things (ouch). Just curious, ever hear of a coil going bad and causing a similar problem?
 
Welp...I guess we can stick a fork in'er. Crank is spun. I had #1 at TDC, #3 was close to TDC and #4 was nearly BDC.

How much $$$ am I looking at for this repair? I am guessing it must be re-indexed at a 2-stroke crank shop, and then welded and checked for straightness? Or is this something I could attempt to realign and weld myself? Is it recommended to rebuild the crank at the same time? I haven't gotten the engine pulled yet, but started this morning (hood, pipes, carbs off). I didn't want to go any further until I knew about how much this repair would set me back vs. parting out and getting another sled (gonna stick with a VMax-4 for sure, I am hooked). What shops do you recommend calling in the IN/MI/OH area?

I may end up parting this dude out, and looking for a newer 800 that is in good shape. Any thoughts?
 
Rading VmaxMike's thread on the exact same issue now, looks like all of the info I need is there. Thank you everyone for the help to this point. I will update once there is news.
 
Well, sending the cranks today to Pete Nydahl. Took a couple days to find a shop locally that had a clutch puller tool I could use. Looks like some novices have already tried to fix the crank problem at some point. I am hoping this doesn't look too messed up. There appears to be a dowel pin between the crank and gear that is supposed to lock them together. Is this factory? or an attempt to keep them aligned?
 

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To my knowledge they add the pins to stenghtn the crank when they weld it. All my cranks i set away to fix and get welded by bender racing came back pinned.
 
Thanks for the info, they didn't look original to me, but someone apparently tried to weld them, and really just buggered it all up. And even with the pins, they have spun. We will see what Pete says at the crank shop. I am hoping they will be OK. I don't see why no to be honest.

My next feeling is that they probably weren't ever timed properly to begin with. There are several punch marks on teh crank and the gears, that I suppose are supposed to line up, so anyone who was punch marking the gears couldn't have gotten them right on, had to be off a bit. All of the pistons are OK, with exception to #2 that has some scoring (hoping it will hone out mostly). I am getting new rings and honing all 4 jugs, removing one of the head gaskets, and re-jetting the carbs. I looked in teh mains last night, and it still has 140's in there. The pilot air screws were all set completely different (1.5 to 3.5 turns out). So, carbs and clutches are getting done while I wait for the crank to come back.

I ordered the 43/37 helix from Hauck yesterday, and all of the other parts from Yamaha for YammieGods set-up. You think I should go ahead and re-jet to the 135's right now? or wait until I get it back together and running before I tune the carbs? I will check the pilot jets this evening, that should tell more (if they are 50's or 47.5's)if the 140's were put in intentionally, or never updated to 135's. You guys agree with this thinking?
 
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